I must say that I am amazed by this discussion about data sharing and cheating. It is all driven by the assumption that we have cheaters in our race groups, even with the complete lack of evidence, including from Nationals.

I am NOT willing to have my data forcefully shared with anyone by any rule. As others have said, if I want to share my information, that is up to me. The bottom line is, we are competing AGAINST each other. This is a competitive sport. If you don't like that, go do something else. I am not "required" to help others. I get to choose to do so if I want. I have no beef with those that choose not to help others and have no desire to "force" them to do so.

I DO NOT TRUST our directors with my data, any data. I should not be required to trust them nor to share my performance data with anyone that I don't want to, and that includes directors. After all, the directors are my direct competitors too. There is no way that this makes any sense to me.

If there is a concern about someone cheating, there are plenty of ways to find that out in the rules now. It appears to me that this has become a "big deal" in the past several months suddenly. Why? If someone thinks that cheating is going on, put up money to tear things down and find out. Is this coming from a few individuals? It seems that way so far. Let them use the rules to get their proof. Don't put some new burden on us. There is dyno testing that can be done, there are tear downs, there are lots of ways to deal with "cheating". Use them and only talk about doing something more if that is proven to not work. All this talk of cheaters is getting very old to me since we have nothing to prove that there is a problem, only rumors and "concern" from a few unnamed people.

Sterling Doc, you posted that there was a problem with chips and headers that led to them being made illegal and you said it as if it were so. Do you have ANY testing proof that this was true? The allegation was made in So. Cal. (because of one person) and I have asked Tim for any proof. He has, as of now, not provided any proof, testing results, etc. to document that chips and headers ACTUALLY created a performance advantage. It was rumor that, as far as I know, was NEVER proven and tore the class apart on the basis of rumor and, so far, unproven fear. We should not be going down that path again.

If you are setting out to destroy this class, you are going in a great direction. If there is this much concern about something, I respectfully suggest that the concern be about why the car count was down at Nationals and who worked actively to keep it down rather than this line of discussion.

Respectfully,

Big Dog

Big Dog wrote:


Jim,
You actually helped make our point in this concept of data gathering and sharing. The chip and header deal was rumor based. Tim and I talked about getting a "cheater header" and putting it on the dyno. However neither of us had $650 to spend on something that was either not overpriced and worthless or if proven to be a gain would be rendered illegal.

Also at the time we had no dyno rules or power limits.

If we had a data Aq rule we could have easily gotten some data and made reasonable attempt to determine if said cars performance was better down the straights or not. If it was we could then show that to all and kill the rumors. Same way if it was not a performance gain at all.

Rumors about parts hurt racing classes. People talking about needing a motor built by "Ricky Bobbie" to have a chance hurt the class. Talk about need a super special header or super special intake (ie ram air) or super special chip. Facts blow that away. Dyno's are one way to get factual data, Data Aq is another. Data Aq is easier to obtain that dyno's where most tracks don't have dyno's at easy access. The downside is Data Aq is not accurate in terms of raw hp numbers. However trends are important. Sharing data is important to dispell myths. Look Eric dynoed 4 cars and the most hp came from a basic build 9.5:1 piston motors. That information is very useful as it supports the idea that 10.2:1 pistons are not "must haves".

If a guy is turning the top laps at PIR, but has the lowest top speed going into turn 1 then you know it aint about hp. That guy is driving the car well.


Jim,
I am not looking for cheaters. You know the old saying, "everyone slower than me is great driver and everyone faster is a cheater". You have said that in jest, but you have also seen where someguys falsely believe that. Strict tech inspections and obvious compliance measures are key ways of not just finding cheaters, but SHOWING that the fast guys are doing it all legal and the right way. How many times have people asked you. "Jim I don't know how you do it, but you just blew by me on that straight!" You tell them "exit speed my friend" and they still look at you funny. Well now show the data that proves you made it throug the last corner 3 mph faster and carried that past the slower drivers making it appear like you accelerated away.

my last post did not go through maybe it was too big ?

I have information and data that I WILL NOT SHARE . I did not ask when I obtained the data and it will not be made public by me.

second thought.

Yes the RMR did not bring 15+ field fillers to Nationals. We did bring the largest amount ... ? I thought we did . If not it was close. The BIG have FUN plan did not work well in 2009. If you would like to know more dig it up or ask your local series director.

The RMR will be doing what we want to do locally to keep our racing "Low cost and equal". We had over 30 drivers in 2010 but we have chosen to not push for rule changes Nation wide in 2011. If Texas or any other region wants to do what we are doing GREAT ! if not GREAT ! Please have fun and grow 944-spec in your region the way you want to ! If that means $2,700+ for a head and/or $10,000+ for an engine and that is what makes your region happy GREAT. have fun !

As series directors we need to stay ahead of legal changes that make cars better than the "SPEC". If gold plated plug wires make 20 extra hp then I will make a rule change to not allow gold plated plug wires. That is what 944-spec is to me. If that is not what you want then chime in and lets talk about it.

last one for now.
the rule change to take away chips and headers saved 944-spec.

in 2006ish 944-spec and 944-cup made plans to merge. Because of the growth of 944-spec outside of SoCal and AZ 944-spec was able to stay a National class. and not merge with 944-cup. was everyone happy with the change ... NO . I said it to Tim before and I will say it many more times THANKS Tim for keeping 944-spec "low cost equal racing". Tim is the So Cal regional series director and his region was hurt most by this change. SoCal lost cars but RMR and others gained more than 2-1 what was lost.

keep up the information flow AND thanks for not making this a flame war ! Great job drivers.