You are right on the money Jim. The difference is in the details of the valve job and set up. That is worth 3-4 of the 10 claimed HP over a stock thickness head. The rest is in shaving to reach the max compression.

Any car can win. But what most drivers do not want to admit is how much they are personally giving up on the track from diving technique and skill.

This is where the biggest differences are in SPEC.

Unless you are running Data Aq. and have optimized your driving to be within 1 second of your theoretical best lap time you still have lots of work to do. Don't mistake HP for driver skill.

A 130 hp car can whup ass on a 140 hp car with driver skill alone.

Be sure to honestly look at your driving and then ask yourself if you are at the same level as the lead drivers. Can you turn consistent laps within .1 of a second on a practice day?

At Miller there were no 140+ hp cars there (according to the dyno). Some of those cars will measure higher at other dynos on different days but not at Miller.

The lap times were comparable to 2009. I think we may have run faster in practice in 09 than 2010.

Have a GREAT DAY ALL!!!

When we started back in 2006/2007, high-120's was a reasonable and competitive engine in my region and others, and we salivated over tales of some fresh engines making 132-133 whp. But now we need 138 whp minimum just to get a "fair" race. Sure, we could ask everyone to add $3k or so to their build costs to get there, but then you can't build a 944-Spec for under $10k, and it makes far more sense to go race in a faster class at that price point. And if we get everyone to 138 whp, someone's just going to find a way to get 148 whp "within the rules", or at least tech-shed legal, and then we're back to square one and need to blow more $$$ on top of what we just did. That has apparently already happened, actually.

There's no end in sight to the arms race, just a dead-end for the growth of our class and the retention of our existing racers. It's to a point where it actually makes far more sense to just outright cheat to get a few extra whp, than to blow thousands on the latest and greatest engine build, and I think that really sucks. That's not something I want to be a part of either way.

Silly us, we just took the opening paragraph of the 944-Spec rulebook seriously...

"The spirit of the class is for all cars to be equal in weight and horsepower and be competitive with one another. The focus will be on driver ability and not dollar ability. This class is not intended to be an engine builder or innovator's class." - 944-Spec rulebook

Yep. The Doctors, Lawyers and Motor Home Drivers are 100% fine with building and building and building engines. Average Joe who camps at the track in a Tent or the back of a Truck is getting screwed here.
"He who makes the money, makes the rules."

Level the playing field. Limit HP.

2009 nationals I ran back of pack with a engine that dyno'ed right before the trip at 127 hp. 2010 I ran solid middle pack soft peddling an engine that was way down on power, a waterpump that was held together with bars stop leak, and a oil temp pegged at over 310... ran four seconds quicker 2:24 than the year before...obviously this wasn't power that was the difference and I think I could have done much better if I had a motor that was even up to the 127 of the year before...

I'm not the sharpest tool in the shed but IF there are 150hp builder motors I'm trying to figure out how anyone is getting that kind of power legally within the current rules! Who has one? what was done to it?

Our AZ race director, a seasoned racer by any measure, said in the last race meeting, know the rules, and if you have an issue protest it. thats why they are there. So I hate being a nitpicker but if there is an issue with a motor, protest it, have it inspected and then we will all know whats going on as opposed to the shadow conspiracy.

And IF something comes up that doesn't fit the spirit of the rules, then we have some factual data to deal with.

or OR instead of protesting, STOP it before it starts. Meh, let me rephrase that. Stop it before it gets out of hand. Limit HP.

Guys,

This has been deciceded, both locally, and nationally for this year. Nothing is going to change for this year. There are passoniate arguements on both sides of this, but it is done. It will be on the table again next year, hopefully with more data to better support those decisions. Send me dynos or any other interesting data to make a case for next year.

As to the original reason for this thread, I don't know why RM region decided not to pursue testing or a gentlemans agreement on HP, I've left that to Chuck and his local leaders, but now that that's been decided as well. Its time to move forward. Chuck says it's "great news", and I'll take him at his word.

Everyone knows their options, and can make their decisions based on that. I wish everyone the best racing they can find/enjoy.

I will lay down this challenge:

For next year, I am going to buy or build a low compression motor, and a reasonably priced car, and I'm going to spank all comers at Mid-Ohio in 2011. Anyone willing to make a Spec-budget friendly wager that they can beat me, in my "reasonably priced car"